Whose Church?

by Catholic on the Cusp
Published/Last Modified on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 6:52 AM CDT

The priest at an area church has decided that he does not want to rise early enough to do a 7:00AM Mass, so those of us who work for a living cannot attend Mass each day as we have for our entire lives. He has also cut his office hours down to only four hours per day, and when asked about it, he said that he "has a life". I am about a hair's width away from leaving the church that I have loved for all my life. When I talk to others about it, they say that it is the priest's church. I thought WE were the church. I called the bishop's office, but got no response. Is there some authority that we can report this guy to in order to have him do his job?

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A Great Gulf Fixed wrote on Sep 8, 2008 2:50 PM:

" Luke 16:19-31. At death, all souls return to God to await judgement. None of the souls can pass from either side of the great fixed gulf to go get, or to go meet, or to "pray" someone else's soul over. Each person is of their own free will with how they live their earthly life, either good or evil. How many parents would feel confident with teachers who only taught parts of a book but yet expected the student to be able to pass a final exam? We must read the scriptures daily, even for our own sakes. Bless You. "

No Rapture No Wings No Purgatory wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:14 PM:

" (1Thes4:17), to the person who wants to know, read 1Thes4:13 which comes before this verse. Read the part that says, "I would not have you to be ignorant, bretheren...." -it is important to read all verses not just one and to also always consider the subject. Also, read Ezekiel 13:18-23 to find out what God thinks about those who promote handkerchiefs and teach others that their souls will "fly." Behold, he is AGAINST that! We have for as long as our flesh bodies exists to serve God. There is no purgatory and no second chances. You cannot serve two masters. "

B.Bean wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:03 AM:

" Preist are human too ! they will have to answer for their sins just like you and I. Please dont let one or two bad people change your faith, if you do your faith must have been questionable already. "

Answer to your question wrote on Sep 5, 2008 1:36 PM:

" God have authority and dominion over all of us including priest. Maybe the priest is busy with other ungodly business. Go to the lord in prayer the priest, preacher and all human being will have to bow down and confess our sins. Stay prayful!!!

The Devil you will find them even in the church we all must repent. "

To No Wings wrote on Sep 5, 2008 12:47 PM:

" Tell me what 1Thessalonians 4 means to you? Even catholics believe the soul goes to purgatory, does it crawl there? "

sam wrote on Sep 3, 2008 3:19 PM:

" The writer of this rant needs to become a Protestant. With all of that whining he/she will fit right in. "

Fellow Reader wrote on Aug 30, 2008 3:40 PM:

" The bible states that there will be famines in the last days. Not for bread, but for truth. (ie: Christ, who IS the Bread of Life). "

No Wings No Rapture wrote on Aug 30, 2008 3:37 PM:

" God's Kingdom will be set up here on earth. The number one way Satan seeks to deceive is by religious confusion. When the Antichrist comes, he will be (perfect in beauty) attractive, and powerful and performing miracles. Read Ezekiel chp 28. He will deceive a multitude of gullible women just as he did Eve and they will run to their husbands and children to get them to follow. Some of the priests and pastors will be deceived too because how many of them actually READ that bible? Don't be Deceived! "

Servant of God wrote on Aug 30, 2008 3:23 PM:

" In the bible God says, "I have foretold you all things." The operative word here is the word..."all." God had Apostles, prophets, minor prophets and servants preaching and teaching. Don't depend on the priest to mediate your relationship with God. God's eyes go to and fro throughout the whole earth daily. Each of us will stand alone on judgement day, not with a priest or pastor. You are responsible for reading the scriptures yourself to show yourself blameless before God. Your commitment is to God and the Word not the church. The church is the many-membered body of Christ. "

Kim wrote on Aug 30, 2008 1:40 AM:

" In the earliest history of the Church, there was no clear distinction between bishops& priests as there is in the modern Church;this developed later.Timothy&Titus were two of the overseers St.Paul appointed to help him govern the Churches and to them he wrote his pastoral epistles on how best to care for their respective charges.O Timothy,guard what has been entrusted to you 1 Tim 6:20,Obey your leaders and submit to them;for they are keeping watch over your souls, as men who will have to give account. Let them do this joyfully,and not sadly,for that would be of no advantage.Hebrews13:17 "

Kim wrote on Aug 30, 2008 1:14 AM:

" cont.Jesus established Peter as the head of the college of Apostles. Matthew 16.Realizing that the commission to preach the gospel to all nations transcended their persons, the Apostles used the authority they had been given--the authority of Christ himself--to establish successors to this authority: fellow Apostles, and later, bishops.They did this starting at the very beginning of the Church by electing a replacement for Judas (see Acts 1). "

Kim wrote on Aug 30, 2008 12:58 AM:

" Sacred Scripture itself makes it very clear that when even the most sincere believers are left to themselves without a guiding authority, they will wander off into error.Galatians 1:6-8,2 Thessalonians 2:15,& 2 Tim 4:3-4.Our Lord himself established the Apostles with the authority to teach in his name until his coming again at the end of time. He promised them the Holy Spirit to keep them free from all error.Luke 10:16.,Luke 22:29-30,John 15:27,&John 16:13. "

To KIm wrote on Aug 29, 2008 3:17 PM:

" So Kim, just where does it say that Peter was catholic and he was to build a catholic denomination? "

Cusp wrote on Aug 29, 2008 10:50 AM:

" To Kim, just so you know, my faith in God and in Jesus Christ is not affected at all. I refuse, however, to continue sitting through sermons delivered by people who do not practice what they preach. I never said that other ministers are not flawed: we are all human. My problem is with priests being placed by themselves and others on pedestals as though they are closer to God than the rest of us. Then they turn around and fail to follow their vows. "

Observer wrote on Aug 29, 2008 9:32 AM:

" We're going round and round with this. Jesus told St. Peter, "Thou art Peter, and upon this Rock I will build my Church, and the gates of h&ll shall not prevail against it. Whatever you bind on Earth will be bound in Heaven, and whatever you loose on Earth will be loosed in Heaven. And I will be with you always, even to the end of the World. Peter was the head. He and the Apostles organized the Church and provided for the system of succession, starting with replacing Judas. The authority of that Church continues until this date. "

To Kim wrote on Aug 28, 2008 11:02 PM:

" If Jesus didn't intend for the bible to be sole authority, then where are we to get authority from? "

Kim wrote on Aug 28, 2008 3:12 PM:

" Mark 16:15 - Jesus commands the apostles to "preach," not write, and only three apostles wrote. The others who did not write were not less faithful to Jesus, because Jesus gave them no directive to write. There is no evidence in the Bible or elsewhere that Jesus intended the Bible to be sole authority of the Christian faith. "

Kim wrote on Aug 28, 2008 8:26 AM:

" On the Cusp.Continuing in ones faith does not equate supporting the bad behavior of priests.What ever faith you follow,I am certain that improprieties have occured.Do you really think God will send you or I to the fires of heck,because of the bad deeds of others?I will be judged by not by scripture alone but by my deeds in life. "

On The Cusp wrote on Aug 27, 2008 1:19 PM:

" As for "Grandma", can you tell me what is the proper place to voice my complaints? I have tried vicars and bishops, but they are in the same boat as the priests and refuse to address these problems. Can you give me the pope's address? "

On The Cusp wrote on Aug 27, 2008 1:18 PM:

" Okay, a FEW families go on vacation during the summer months. Most do not, especially now with gas prices so high. Go ahead and keep defending the priests' indefensible behavior and see where it gets you. They may not be answerable to anyone here, but there will come a time when they will have to answer for their misdeeds in Christ's name. I am amazed that you all continue to defend poor behavior. If they were in regular jobs, they would have been fired long ago. "

Kim wrote on Aug 27, 2008 3:05 AM:

" Conversely, portions of the narrative do not apply to each referent. Mary did not experience literal pain when bringing forth the Messiah, but she suffered figuratively (the prophecy that a sword would pierce her heart at the Crucifixion). Eve did not ascend to heaven. And the Church did not bring forth the Messiah (rather, the Messiah brought forth his Church). "

Kim wrote on Aug 27, 2008 3:04 AM:

" Finally, the Woman is Mary because she is the mother of Jesus, the child who will rule the nations with a rod of iron (19:11–16).Because the Woman is a four-way symbol, different aspects of the narrative apply to different referents. Like Mary, she is pictured as being in heaven and she flies (mirroring Mary’s Assumption). Like the Church, she is persecuted by the Devil after the Ascension of Christ. Like Israel, she experiences great trauma as the Messiah is brought forth (figuratively) from the nation. And like Eve, it is her seed with which the serpent has his primary conflict. "

Kim wrote on Aug 27, 2008 3:02 AM:

" cont.The Woman is the Church because, as 12:17 tells us, "the rest of her offspring" are those who bear witness to Jesus, making them Christians.

The Woman is Eve because she is part of the three-way conflict also involving her Seed and the Dragon, who is identified with the ancient serpent (the one from Eden) in 20:2. This mirrors the conflict in Genesis 3:15 between Eve, the serpent, and her unborn seed—which in turn is a symbol of the conflict between Mary, Satan, and Jesus. "

Kim wrote on Aug 27, 2008 2:58 AM:

" Confused wrote was referencing(Rev. 12:1–2,5,17)There is a lot of debate on who the woman is.The Woman in Revelation 12 is part of the fusion imagery/polyvalent symbolism that is found in the book.She has four referents: Israel,the Church, Eve, and Mary.She is Israel because she is associated with the sun, the moon, and twelve stars. These symbols are drawn from Genesis 37:9–11, in which the patriarch Joseph has a dream of the sun and moon(symbolizing his father and mother) and stars (representing his brothers), which bow down to him. Taken together, the sun, moon,&twelve stars symbolize the people of Israel. "

To Confused wrote on Aug 26, 2008 7:59 AM:

" Give me scripture to back what you are saying. Explain about the woman clothed with the sun. I believe God knows best and that's why I prefer to know where you are reading all of this in the bible. What do you think about 1Thess. 4:16,17? "

Fed Up wrote on Aug 25, 2008 1:58 PM:

" What a bunch of morons!!! What would it take for you people to see what is right in front of your face and finally say enough? I was an altar boy. I attended seminary. I was educated in Catholic schools. Now I see a bunch of arrogant jerks wearing vestments. They think that we are there to serve them. "Minister" is a verb as well as a noun, and someone needs to point that out to some of these so-called priests. Open your eyes and smell the coffee. "

Grandma wrote on Aug 24, 2008 6:06 PM:

" Seems to me this is not the place to voice your complaint. "

Confused wrote on Aug 24, 2008 3:57 AM:

" And, if you don't believe that the Eucharist is the actual body, blood, soul, & divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ, when consecrated by an ordained Catholic priest, then I pray that God has mercy on your immortal soul for your blasphemy! I expect that when you die your plan is FOR YOU TO TELL GOD what He meant and what He should have done to fit YOUR beliefs!!!!! After all who knows better, you or God?????????? "

Confused wrote on Aug 24, 2008 3:43 AM:

" Again, another bunch of nonsense. If you had done all what you declare, you would not be saying what you say here. That is not what our Catechism and Bible studies are, YOU WERE NOT THERE!!!!! The Catholic Church does teach The book of Revelations. It's in the Bible, written by St. John the Apostle. We don't teach the "science fiction" BS that you've been taught about the end of the World. Remember, "a woman clothed with the sun..." There's a reference to the Virgin Mary, Mother of God. (continued...) "

To Confused wrote on Aug 23, 2008 11:07 PM:

" cont... I never learned about the rapture of the church, the seven year tribulation and armmageddon. I never learned that I had to accept Jesus Christ as my personal Savior. As for the Eucharist, it is not the literal body of Christ. He was sacrificed once and said IT IS FINISHED. No more sacrificing. I really didn't want to get in this, I was merely saying that you can learn from other churches not just the catholic church. "

To Confused wrote on Aug 23, 2008 10:56 PM:

" I don't want to argue but I was in catechism the whole time I was in school. I learned to say repetitious prayers, learned to pray to saints that were dead and yes I went to a bible study class. I never went back because our class was on standing up and practicing talking in tongues. I know that speaking in tongues is a spiritual gift and I know you either have the gifts or you don't. You can't practice getting them. Not everyone has all the gifts. cont. "

meancomment wrote on Aug 21, 2008 1:46 PM:

" Where have you been. They have paid billions for what the priests are really doing. the Church has no money now. "

Confused wrote on Aug 21, 2008 11:37 AM:

" (continued...) Lo & behold, somebody enthusiastically approaches them with a slue of Bible verses, all misinterpreted and out of context, and “it’s the Catholic Church’s fault for not teaching them”. Were they not listening to the Scriptures and homilies at Mass? Where were they when there were prayer meetings and Bible classes at the Catholic Church? "

Confused wrote on Aug 21, 2008 11:22 AM:

" To "A Baptist": It always amazes me how some people, who I call "Catholics in name only" will, maybe go to Mass on most Sundays, but never make an attempt to do anything more. They did not attend catechism while in school, join a prayer group, Bible study, or even own a Bible. All they know about the Mass is that they should be there an hour a week and that there is a lot of sitting, standing, and kneeling. They are oblivious that the Eucharist is the actually body, blood, soul, & divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ. (continued...) "

a baptist wrote on Aug 19, 2008 7:13 PM:

" I am not writing to put down anyone but let me just say that I was a catholic for 30+ years and I changed to baptist about 20 years ago. It's not just singing and preaching. We also have Sunday School classes on Sunday morning and Wednesday evening. I have learned so much since I have been going there. Not telling you to change but just saying you can learn at other churches as well and you are right the people are the church=the body of Christ. "

Not anymore wrote on Aug 19, 2008 2:00 PM:

" How about a priest that is still in his pajamas at 10:00 a.m. or does mass but says very little. He lets the Deacon say the mass while he sits. They make sure you get your envelopes in the mail in plenty of time to pay your dues for entrance into heaven! Don't go there anymore. There are too many other churches with excellent priest who actually say the mass themselves! "

Be Glad you have a PRIEST wrote on Aug 19, 2008 1:00 PM:

" Thank God you have a Priest in your community. Our church parish shares a priest with another parish. We share a priest for weekday and weekend masses... However, we have an awesome Deacon that lives in our rectory if any one in our community needs anything!!!! "

Asking wrote on Aug 19, 2008 10:09 AM:

" Have you ever encouraged a young man to become a priest? Your own son or nephew perhaps? With the growing number of Catholics, the aging generation of parishioners, and the need for more priests, the demands are tremendous. Priests don't just work on Sundays. They are "on call" 24 hours a day, seven days a week. They are called out to annoint the dying in the middle of the night, visit hospitals, council people, hear confessions, instruct engaged couples, etc......as well as conduct Sunday and weekday Masses. "

Confused wrote on Aug 19, 2008 9:46 AM:

" Because you cannot attend Mass when it is suitable for you, you are considering leaving the Church? That's like "cutting your nose to spite your face". Then when would you attend Mass? Other churches only assemble on Sunday mornings and some on Wednesday nights, and only have preaching and singing. You would not receive the benefits of the Sacraments. The Catholic Church is the only one which offers services every day of the week. St. Peter's Masses are at 5:30pm every Monday, Wednesday, & Friday. 12:10pm on Tuesdays & 6:30am on Thursdays. Other area Catholic Churches have various schedules. "

Brian wrote on Aug 19, 2008 8:34 AM:

" Strength in numbers. If there are other people in the church who have the same issues ,why don't ya'll write "en' mass". Or have all the same folk call the Bishop's office on the same day. "

Faith wrote on Aug 19, 2008 8:25 AM:

" My church parish does reduce the rectory hours during summer and that may affect the early morning masses. In the summer lots of families are on vacation and attendance is lower. That may be the reason. When some people feel they have to explain their changes they do get defensive. Don't let this frustrate you so that you would leave your church. This will pass. "

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